Watchlords

Surely if you're going to call your finest watch The Citizen, there should be only one. Same as King Seiko, but I won't digress. Been thinking about an AQ4020 for a long time now, the The Citzen Chronomaster with the paper dial. I just like the way the Japanese do business - Salary man, as the esteemed Robatsu would say - watches. I love their style. I'm going to be in business for a while yet so wouldn't mind a watch to suit. Love the treated titanium, love the HAQ, love the immaculate finishing. Ticks pretty much all the boxes:



Or so I thought. Should a practical everyday watch have lume? Does it matter when we all carry smart phones? I can't remember the last time I looked at my watch in the dark. Nevertheless, for a practical business/salary man watch, lume would seem to be a useful feature. Pulling out your phone to know when your lapdance is up would be uncouth. And possibly against the rules? Citizen, the Greatest Watch Manufacturer in the World, knows this. They understand. To wit, the The Citizen Chronomaster AQ4030:



It's got lume. It's a better case size (40ish mm). It's actually slightly cheaper! BUT. It doesn't have the GS hands and indices as per the 4020 (when I say 'GS', I believe Seiko and Citizen use the same contractor)

I want a practical watch but I also want GS hands and indices. I'm probably going to get the impractical 4020.

As much as I like the 2nd watch, the first is soooooo crisp.

AlbertaTime wrote: ↑

January 26th 2023, 9:15pm

As much as I like the 2nd watch, the first is soooooo crisp.

This on that.

Yep. You boys are right. Eff lume.

AQ4020 is a real standout.

There is pretty much a Chronomaster for everyone so long as you are you’re basic Japanese salaryman

And it’s fine with Citizen if you’re not, as there are 10-20 million salaryman at home. Same deal for whoever cranks out all those black suits.

There was a nice automatic The Citizen maybe 8-10 years ago. Old school GS play, cream and black dials. Always looked nice in the case. They didn’t seem to push the line but I wouldn’t mind having one of these turn up, just finding reference isn’t easy but here’s a rendering


The AQ4041 is something of a King Seiko tribute, Taro Tanaka would be proud. The blue dial version has a lot of fans. 38.3mm, titanium.

The automatic The Citizens.

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Looks generic

codguy wrote: ↑

January 27th 2023, 5:36pm

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Looks generic

By George, oddguy, you’re teachable. Keep at it, you’ll get there.

Love these. The white paper dial is my favorite, but I’d get the black for contrast. If I were younger, the white for sure.

If it wasn’t part of The Signature Collection then it is inherently less interesting - though the fit and finish may be similarly excellent.

The attention to detail on the GTS model(s) is/are superb:

codguy wrote: ↑

January 27th 2023, 5:36pm

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Looks generic

Yeah, but in a good way IMO. Like a pain basic simple watch refined to perfection.

jason_recliner wrote: ↑

January 28th 2023, 12:25am

codguy wrote: ↑

January 27th 2023, 5:36pm

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Looks generic

Yeah, but in a good way IMO. Like a pain basic simple watch refined to perfection.

That is a nice looking watch recliner and nothing wrong with the fit & finish of a nice $3,000 watch. But why make it look like the dozens of cheap $400 homage models by the same company?
Does that AQ4020 look sharp? YEP. Does it look like some of their inexpensive models to me? Absolutely.


Guess it's why I gravitate towards brands that limit their low end offerings and probably why I won't purchase a Grand Seiko.

Nuvolari wrote: ↑

January 27th 2023, 9:46pm

If it wasn’t part of The Signature Collection then it is inherently less interesting - though the fit and finish may be similarly excellent.

The attention to detail on the GTS model(s) is/are superb:

6A657089-6AB4-4CFB-9B94-0384F93AED07.jpeg
559AAE09-1C0E-4D64-87DD-28445AA21238.jpeg
554C58F7-F36E-45A4-B187-96016A087FE0.jpeg

I’ve always admired that model

jason_recliner wrote: ↑

January 28th 2023, 12:25am

codguy wrote: ↑

January 27th 2023, 5:36pm

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Looks generic

Yeah, but in a good way IMO. Like a pain basic simple watch refined to perfection.

It’s the Sushijiro approach that is embedded in Japanese and East Asian cultures in a way that can be very foreign and incomprehensible to westerners if they don’t gain an appreciation for it.

Worth noting hat these tend to be JDM watches and for this reason, not what a lot of westerners want.

Codguy’s aversion and specifically the reason he states means the system is working.

robatsu wrote: ↑

January 28th 2023, 9:15am

Nuvolari wrote: ↑

January 27th 2023, 9:46pm

If it wasn’t part of The Signature Collection then it is inherently less interesting - though the fit and finish may be similarly excellent.

The attention to detail on the GTS model(s) is/are superb:

6A657089-6AB4-4CFB-9B94-0384F93AED07.jpeg
559AAE09-1C0E-4D64-87DD-28445AA21238.jpeg
554C58F7-F36E-45A4-B187-96016A087FE0.jpeg

I’ve always admired that model

…those were my wine thoughts.

My coffee thoughts today are, “…yeah, it’s a nifty watch, but it doesn’t fit under a dress shirt for shit” - which does make it more of an orange in a kumquat conversation {or, in Aussie, ‘cumquat’}.

I find it to be a cool watch but now that I think about it - it’s a shitty dress watch.

I took those pictures in the garage with no light tent and a mediocre camera…

Today, I think I use my phone too much - but DSLR can be a PITA!

Okay, my bad - now back to your regular scheduled {thread}!

I think a type has been clearly identified in this and other threads. For lack of a better term, call it UJW, for universal Japanese watch.

Old, and hence not bold, motorcyclists remember UJM, universal Japanese motorcycle, from the 70s and 80s

They all looked the same and had same features jurt bigger or smaller engines

And people had a full spectrum of feelings on them, all usually well founded. Love them for reliability and performance, disdain them for lack of soul or individuality.

This style of watch, say stick indices, dauphin or stick hands, and angular case in a moderate grammar of design deal, the sword cuts and do forth

And I’d say the first full expression of the UJW was seen in 56KS, both case and dial.

And it just spread out from there. Taro Tanaka apparently was trying to define a native Japanese watch style and seems like he succeeded, it really is in the weave.

I had a GS SBGA001 once, fell in love it with it from pics, thought ok that could be my daily wearer

UJW with champagne dial


Loved it except the watch was just too damn big at 40/41mm, so I very reluctantly sold it:

Took me a while to figure out why I liked the citizen nb1050 do much but basically SBGA001 scaled down to 38mm, perfect for me.

I’ve had euro bikes too and full understand why people didn’t like the Japanese bikes , don’t know if that is still a thing. Can definitely understand why some don’t like the UJW pattern

Yeah, I like the way Japanese design and style a lot of products. Clean, functional, often free of decorative flourishes. Anti-baroque. I happen to like the UJW style so it works for me having many watches in the same basic style but varying levels of refinement and price points.

Coincidentally, I reckon the CB750/1000 looks pretty much perfect.

Royal Orient was moving into GS territory, an effort they got shut down when Seiko completed the buyout.

They did a really nice UJW, the WE0031EK, with a little Rolex maxi case thing going on

Super clean dial if you are ok with power reserve and great finishing

Pictured below with my SBGA001. A gorgeous watch but also too damn big at 40mm

If it weren’t for they I’d still have both.

Royal Orient was a great idea for those like me who want the best finish and aren't that fussed about the movement. Too bad Seiko started going all VW and artificially restricting their brands.

jason_recliner wrote: ↑

January 29th 2023, 3:25pm

Royal Orient was a great idea for those like me who want the best finish and aren't that fussed about the movement. Too bad Seiko started going all VW and artificially restricting their brands.

Seems like they killed the OS300 as well.