I hate Stuhrling Original

watches under $!000
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I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by mrneddles » July 19th 2010, 6:23am

Who is with me?

I can't stand the sight of that intellectual property thief Larry Magen with his windblown hair, slickster suits, and shit-eating Cheshire cat grin. I hate him more than all three of the unholy trinity (EL, MD, JS) combined.

Take almost any Stuhrling and you will find a high end brand that the design has been lifted from. No, I don't want a tourbillon for $800 if it means stealing Cartier's Balon Bleu Tourbillon design.

Fake "Original" designs for fake people or just plain uniformed dumbasses.

Rant over, thanks.
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by Guest » July 19th 2010, 6:46am

I bought a couple about 6 years ago. Junk, sent 'em back. Heard they had cleaned up their act since then, tried another one. sent it back, not impressed.
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by eddiea » July 19th 2010, 6:55am

I dislike homages of all kind... no disrespect to anyone who like or have one of them but , it doesn't matter if it is a Panerai knockoff like Marina Military or a Stuhrling, to me is stealing others designs and I personally prefer to buy say, a cheap but real deal Seiko, that a watch with a personality issue, pretending to be something else, legal may be but it
doesn't make right IMHO.
Larry appears to be diferent in the way that, he openly disclosed the watch/movements origins but my personal feeling is ... just because he have no choice ...his quartz lines are much better that his Chinese mechanical (or auto) variety IMHO
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by nlandin » July 19th 2010, 7:15am

mrneddles wrote:Who is with me?

I can't stand the sight of that intellectual property thief Larry Magen with his windblown hair, slickster suits, and shit-eating Cheshire cat grin. I hate him more than all three of the unholy trinity (EL, MD, JS) combined.

Take almost any Stuhrling and you will find a high end brand that the design has been lifted from. No, I don't want a tourbillon for $800 if it means stealing Cartier's Balon Bleu Tourbillon design.

Fake "Original" designs for fake people or just plain uniformed dumbasses.

Rant over, thanks.


I like SO, and I'm not "fake", but I may be a uniformed dumbass when it comes to watches.
For the price, I'll buy, never had a problem with any of my SOs and who gives a fuck if they "copy" another design, take a look at everything in the fashion world. Until I hit the lotto, I'll buy homages and look-a-likes (no replicas). If you can buy the real Cartier Tourbillon, then good for you; why do you think folks buy the M300, cause it looks like a Phantom, but no one rips about that, they know "It's not a Phantom".
Thanks for sharing and letting me vent right back at ya!
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by BigCheez » July 19th 2010, 7:21am

Replicas and homages of current designs are THEFT and are for poseurs.

No better than the dopey kit cars of the 80s that purported to look like a lambo or ferrari but used volkswagen or fiero drivetrains.

Pretending.

Now an homage to a vintage/classic design made by the same manufacture as the original is another story.
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by Guest » July 19th 2010, 7:37am

It's hard for me to respect a company that has no creativity. To just copy another brand says little about how they view themselves In the watch Industry. Not really much different than a replica, they are probably made under the same roof or one very much like It
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by mrneddles » July 19th 2010, 7:47am

nlandin wrote:
mrneddles wrote:Who is with me?

I can't stand the sight of that intellectual property thief Larry Magen with his windblown hair, slickster suits, and shit-eating Cheshire cat grin. I hate him more than all three of the unholy trinity (EL, MD, JS) combined.

Take almost any Stuhrling and you will find a high end brand that the design has been lifted from. No, I don't want a tourbillon for $800 if it means stealing Cartier's Balon Bleu Tourbillon design.

Fake "Original" designs for fake people or just plain uniformed dumbasses.

Rant over, thanks.


I like SO, and I'm not "fake", but I may be a uniformed dumbass when it comes to watches.
For the price, I'll buy, never had a problem with any of my SOs and who gives a fuck if they "copy" another design, take a look at everything in the fashion world. Until I hit the lotto, I'll buy homages and look-a-likes (no replicas). If you can buy the real Cartier Tourbillon, then good for you; why do you think folks buy the M300, cause it looks like a Phantom, but no one rips about that, they know "It's not a Phantom".
Thanks for sharing and letting me vent right back at ya!


Just a point of correction, if you are talking about a Chrysler 300, not M300, then that model looks like a Bentley. Rolls Royce makes the Phantom.

"Who gives a fuck" about copying someone else's designs, well, I'm sure anyone who thinks for a living would disagree with that statement. It's called intellectual property. Imagine the guy who makes a living, feeds his family, by sitting at a drawing board designing and perfecting a watch every hour of his working life. After months of designing, tweaking, and perfecting the watch, it is produced and displayed at Basel. Then the Grey Fox Magen comes by the booth, copies the design, slaps Stuhrling on it, and sells it to a bunch of people who don't know any better.

I bet that guy who slaved over the watch would be pretty pissed.
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by nlandin » July 19th 2010, 8:24am

mrneddles"][quote="nlandin"][quote="mrneddles wrote:
Just a point of correction, if you are talking about a Chrysler 300, not M300, then that model looks like a Bentley. Rolls Royce makes the Phantom.

"Who gives a fuck" about copying someone else's designs, well, I'm sure anyone who thinks for a living would disagree with that statement. It's called intellectual property. Imagine the guy who makes a living, feeds his family, by sitting at a drawing board designing and perfecting a watch every hour of his working life. After months of designing, tweaking, and perfecting the watch, it is produced and displayed at Basel. Then the Grey Fox Magen comes by the booth, copies the design, slaps Stuhrling on it, and sells it to a bunch of people who don't know any better.

I bet that guy who slaved over the watch would be pretty pissed.


LOL Yes, I made a mistake on the Phantom...the dumbass in me came out.
I agree, the orginal designer would be pissed. The problem is not just limited to SO, your argument has to included many "Micro-brands", I belive that is the term used here, that have or use the same design. Look at many dive watches, they all look the same, with little tweeks, but they all have the same over all look.
If I may ask, is your hate for SO or the President of SO? It's all about the retail business, you gotta sell to get the food on the table.
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by LIES ALL LIES!!! » July 19th 2010, 9:12am

Larry Magan is one of the nicest most customer oriented guys you will ever hope to meet when it comes to watch company reps. I promise you that.

As for SO stealing designs. Sure they do, look at their new Admiral, looks like a bigger Corum Admiral, even took the name. But for every watch designed after Corum, AP, Panerai, Hublet, etc... They have models of their design like the Madman, Axis, Il Capo, Meridian, etc....

But honestly, who does not homage other brands works these days? Unless you are paying $10K starting for something totally original all the major players in the affordable range have models that look close to some other high end brand's model.
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by Guest » July 19th 2010, 9:24am

LIES ALL LIES!!! wrote:Larry Magan is one of the nicest most customer oriented guys you will ever hope to meet when it comes to watch company reps. I promise you that.

As for SO stealing designs. Sure they do, look at their new Admiral, looks like a bigger Corum Admiral, even took the name. But for every watch designed after Corum, AP, Panerai, Hublet, etc... They have models of their design like the Madman, Axis, Il Capo, Meridian, etc....

But honestly, who does not homage other brands works these days? Unless you are paying $10K starting for something totally original all the major players in the affordable range have models that look close to some other high end brand's model.


I would have to disagree with your above statement, you must consider Oris, Omega, Hamilton, TAG, Ebel, Panerai, hell I don't have the time to keep typing. Point is there are MANY watch companies that offer great timepieces for FAR LESS than $10K that are pretty "original". And just because SO has some models that are unique you must ask why not stand on those alone? The choice to blatantly pay homage (read rip off) others designs is just a piss poor choice. It's the easy road and one I will never respect, no matter how nice the "face" of the company is.
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by Ditchdoc » July 19th 2010, 9:32am

Welcome to the forum mrneddles! Everyone is entitled to their opinion but I have to disagree with you on a couple of points.

Yes. Many are homages of which I'm not a huge fan but many of the low end "TV" brands copy from the the higher end companies.

I can't speak to the quality because I have never owned one but from all I have read (your post aside) SO seems to be of reasonably good quality for the price.

IMO, Larry seems to be a stand up guy. He doesn't engage in the many deceptive ploys that EL, DM and others do. I've heard him on many occasions answer questions honestly as to the origins and make up of his watches. to my knowlege he has never tried to cloak a chinese watch with a swiss label to sell a watch. I've never heard any CS complaints about SO as I have the numurous complaints about other similar brands.

I admit that I am not an expert on SO or Larry Megan for that matter. If you own a SO and think its junk.....okay but I have not seen any evidence to justify your attack on Larry's character. He seems like a good guy for a salesman. LOL!

Enjoy the forum
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by Guest » July 19th 2010, 10:03am

LIES ALL LIES!!! wrote:Larry Magan is one of the nicest most customer oriented guys you will ever hope to meet when it comes to watch compan
As for SO stealing designs. Sure they do, look at their new Admiral, looks like a bigger Corum Admiral, even took the name. But for every watch designed after Corum, AP, Panerai, Hublet, etc... They have models of their design like the Madman, Axis, Il Capo, Meridian, etc....

But honestly, who does not homage other brands works these days? Unless you are paying $10K starting for something totally original all the major players in the affordable range have models that look close to some other high end brand's model.
I happen to agree with most of what you said. Im not crazy about wearing a exact copy of a famous Swiss brand. One example Is SO(cant remember the name off hand) hommage of a Ulysses Nardin Maxi Marine. It was almost a 1.1 copy, not my cup of tea really. But many watch, cars,clothing, etc etc etc companys draw Inspration from well know products,this Is a plane simple fact. If someone dosent care for this type of design pratice, well dont buy the fuckin product, pretty simple stuff actually. As far as I know LM Is a good guy,never have I heard anything negitave about him on a personal level. I would never put him In the same company as the shity I, laylow, JS or 20/20. He seems head and shoulders above those clowns.
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by LIES ALL LIES!!! » July 19th 2010, 10:04am

DonBattles wrote:
LIES ALL LIES!!! wrote:Larry Magan is one of the nicest most customer oriented guys you will ever hope to meet when it comes to watch company reps. I promise you that.

As for SO stealing designs. Sure they do, look at their new Admiral, looks like a bigger Corum Admiral, even took the name. But for every watch designed after Corum, AP, Panerai, Hublet, etc... They have models of their design like the Madman, Axis, Il Capo, Meridian, etc....

But honestly, who does not homage other brands works these days? Unless you are paying $10K starting for something totally original all the major players in the affordable range have models that look close to some other high end brand's model.


I would have to disagree with your above statement, you must consider Oris, Omega, Hamilton, TAG, Ebel, Panerai, hell I don't have the time to keep typing. Point is there are MANY watch companies that offer great timepieces for FAR LESS than $10K that are pretty "original". And just because SO has some models that are unique you must ask why not stand on those alone? The choice to blatantly pay homage (read rip off) others designs is just a piss poor choice. It's the easy road and one I will never respect, no matter how nice the "face" of the company is.


Yep, because Omega certainly does not have anything in their line that resembles other brands.... Neither does Tag.... and Tag did not just get publicly embarrassed when their new proprietary original in house movement was discovered to be a identical clone to a Seiko movement. My point is, this is an industry problem of taking designs and running with them, it's not just limited to shop at home brands.

As for Sturhling Original, if they were a real name in watches they might be able to stand on their own with their own designs, but they are not. They are a struggling company fighting for air time on Shop NBC doing what they can to stay afloat in this economy. Sadly homages are what sell and keep the lights on it seems. Do I condone it? No. Do I understand it? Yes.
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by LIES ALL LIES!!! » July 19th 2010, 10:15am

Badgeek wrote:
LIES ALL LIES!!! wrote:Larry Magan is one of the nicest most customer oriented guys you will ever hope to meet when it comes to watch compan
As for SO stealing designs. Sure they do, look at their new Admiral, looks like a bigger Corum Admiral, even took the name. But for every watch designed after Corum, AP, Panerai, Hublet, etc... They have models of their design like the Madman, Axis, Il Capo, Meridian, etc....

But honestly, who does not homage other brands works these days? Unless you are paying $10K starting for something totally original all the major players in the affordable range have models that look close to some other high end brand's model.
I happen to agree with most of what you said. Im not crazy about wearing a exact copy of a famous Swiss brand. One example Is SO(cant remember the name off hand) hommage of a Ulysses Nardin Maxi Marine. It was almost a 1.1 copy, not my cup of tea really. But many watch, cars,clothing, etc etc etc companys draw Inspration from well know products,this Is a plane simple fact. If someone dosent care for this type of design pratice, well dont buy the fuckin product, pretty simple stuff actually. As far as I know LM Is a good guy,never have I heard anything negitave about him on a personal level. I would never put him In the same company as the shity I, laylow, JS or 20/20. He seems head and shoulders above those clowns.


Totally. I too stay away from the homage pieces as best I can. Sometimes though I discover later a watch I bought is an homage to something else. I just don't keep up with all the brands and their models to know every single design out there. I just don't find looking at pictures of watches that cost more than my truck or house to be a satisfying endeavor. lol

I have spoken to Larry in person on several occasions, as I said he cares about his customers and SO is known for their service before and after the sale. That in my book puts them above Invicta just for that alone. As far as I have seen he has been upstanding and honest as for where the watches and movements are made, and I have even heard him call a spade a spade on air on several occasions by saying that a particular model he is offering looks a lot like another's brands. Basically a nice way to say "hey, we copied some one else, homage piece here".
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by mrneddles » July 19th 2010, 10:18am

LM may not try to cloak the makeup of his watch. But on many occasions I have heard the following conversation, which I will paraphrase:

Jawbone, "Larry, your designers have really knocked it out of the park with the design of this watch" "Larry, SO has really taken their designs to the next level".

LM, "Yes, thank you Jawbone"

When in fact the only designer that SO seems to have probably plugs in, sits in the corner, and is named Xerox.
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by Guest » July 19th 2010, 10:30am

LIES ALL LIES!!! wrote:
Badgeek wrote:
LIES ALL LIES!!! wrote:Larry Magan is one of the nicest most customer oriented guys you will ever hope to meet when it comes to watch compan
As for SO stealing designs. Sure they do, look at their new Admiral, looks like a bigger Corum Admiral, even took the name. But for every watch designed after Corum, AP, Panerai, Hublet, etc... They have models of their design like the Madman, Axis, Il Capo, Meridian, etc....

But honestly, who does not homage other brands works these days? Unless you are paying $10K starting for something totally original all the major players in the affordable range have models that look close to some other high end brand's model.
I happen to agree with most of what you said. Im not crazy about wearing a exact copy of a famous Swiss brand. One example Is SO(cant remember the name off hand) hommage of a Ulysses Nardin Maxi Marine. It was almost a 1.1 copy, not my cup of tea really. But many watch, cars,clothing, etc etc etc companys draw Inspration from well know products,this Is a plane simple fact. If someone dosent care for this type of design pratice, well dont buy the fuckin product, pretty simple stuff actually. As far as I know LM Is a good guy,never have I heard anything negitave about him on a personal level. I would never put him In the same company as the shity I, laylow, JS or 20/20. He seems head and shoulders above those clowns.


Totally. I too stay away from the homage pieces as best I can. Sometimes though I discover later a watch I bought is an homage to something else. I just don't keep up with all the brands and their models to know every single design out there. I just don't find looking at pictures of watches that cost more than my truck or house to be a satisfying endeavor. lol

I have spoken to Larry in person on several occasions, as I said he cares about his customers and SO is known for their service before and after the sale. That in my book puts them above Invicta just for that alone. As far as I have seen he has been upstanding and honest as for where the watches and movements are made, and I have even heard him call a spade a spade on air on several occasions by saying that a particular model he is offering looks a lot like another's brands. Basically a nice way to say "hey, we copied some one else, homage piece here".
Those Un pieces go for around $8000-9000, I would not spend that on a watch even If I had It to spend,but thats just me,lol The other thing Is your average Slop buyer has never heard of the likes of UN,Zenith, A Lange&Sohne, Audemars Piguet,etc etc, wouldn't know a Hublot If It bit them on the arse :smiile:
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by dude » July 19th 2010, 10:36am

. . . I own a couple. Nice entry level watches, used to have killer dial work on many models . . . not so much any more, they have fallen into the bigger is better and brighter is cool mentality.

. . . key to it being "entry level". I bought them before I inderstood the business at all, after awhile I began to see things differently and they are not as satisfying any longer. It's a pretty well travelled road towards WIS-dom . . .

. . . I still wear them on occasion, but the bang is gone . . . I'm spoiled and want more now. As for the homage aspect, like I said . . . I didn't know at first, and also you don't get a lot of originality for a hundred off of TV.
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by Guest » July 19th 2010, 11:09am

LIES ALL LIES!!! wrote:
DonBattles wrote:
LIES ALL LIES!!! wrote:Larry Magan is one of the nicest most customer oriented guys you will ever hope to meet when it comes to watch company reps. I promise you that.

As for SO stealing designs. Sure they do, look at their new Admiral, looks like a bigger Corum Admiral, even took the name. But for every watch designed after Corum, AP, Panerai, Hublet, etc... They have models of their design like the Madman, Axis, Il Capo, Meridian, etc....

But honestly, who does not homage other brands works these days? Unless you are paying $10K starting for something totally original all the major players in the affordable range have models that look close to some other high end brand's model.


I would have to disagree with your above statement, you must consider Oris, Omega, Hamilton, TAG, Ebel, Panerai, hell I don't have the time to keep typing. Point is there are MANY watch companies that offer great timepieces for FAR LESS than $10K that are pretty "original". And just because SO has some models that are unique you must ask why not stand on those alone? The choice to blatantly pay homage (read rip off) others designs is just a piss poor choice. It's the easy road and one I will never respect, no matter how nice the "face" of the company is.


Yep, because Omega certainly does not have anything in their line that resembles other brands.... Neither does Tag.... and Tag did not just get publicly embarrassed when their new proprietary original in house movement was discovered to be a identical clone to a Seiko movement. My point is, this is an industry problem of taking designs and running with them, it's not just limited to shop at home brands.

As for Sturhling Original, if they were a real name in watches they might be able to stand on their own with their own designs, but they are not. They are a struggling company fighting for air time on Shop NBC doing what they can to stay afloat in this economy. Sadly homages are what sell and keep the lights on it seems. Do I condone it? No. Do I understand it? Yes.


Just curious about what Omega, for example, "resemble other brands". As for your words that SO is not a "real brand" I agree, but would add it they just concentrated on their unique designs some of that perception might change. As for their struggling to stay afloat perhaps the first move should be to part with SNBC and shopping networks in general. With regards to the TAG movement issue this is the first I've heard of it. But one incident does not define a company as a whole, now if this pattern were repeated 10-12-20-100 times I would be more concerned. Do I condone what TAG did, no. Do I understand it, no.

By the way, any link's to the TAG movement deal?
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by bodypeersur » July 19th 2010, 11:22am

Here ya go Don.

caliber 1887… OUCH!
Posted by Robert-Jan in Watchlinks, tags: Caliber 1887, In-house, Seiko, Tag Heuer

Pioneering Swiss watchmaking for 150 years. According to the official TAG Heuer website that is, because there is some discussion around the ‘pioneering’ part. Their latest in-house manufactured caliber 1887 movement seems to be based on a Seiko movement. Nothing necessarily wrong with that,?Ǭ� however, TAG Heuer’s press release stated that this caliber 1887 is a ‘designed 100% in-house’ movement. Even according to TAG Heuer’s CEO J. Babin, it is clearly not designed in-house, as the CEO himself is posting messages on several TAG Heuer forums to give an explanation to all TAG Heuer fans. His post on WatchUseek starts like this: “Hi, I’m J.C. Babin the CEO of TAG Heuer, and YES, the new Caliber 1887 is based on a SII (Seiko Instruments Inc.) TC78 platform developped and patented in 1997 (filing) and eversince produced in very limited quantities, apparently for Junghans and Seiko watches in Japan.”

I would have guessed he just would have send another press release, fire the marketing dude who came up with the one-liner and get a communication/PR professional to fix things with the heated forum crowd. Perhaps they’ve already done that, or would it be a coincidence that TAG Heuer’s website is not available right now? (Service Unavailable error)

TAG Heuer’s Caliber 1887 movement

Kyle Stults of Perpetuelle did a very nice job on describing the whole matter in a blog post on his website. Click here for Kyle’s article, http://blog.perpetuelle.com/index.php/watch-news/tag-heuer-shoots-itself-in-the-foot-on-tag-heuer-caliber-1887-launch/#comments. Also check-out TAG Heuer devote website Calibre11.com.
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by boscoe » July 19th 2010, 11:27am

"Larry Magan is one of the nicest most customer oriented guys you will ever hope to meet when it comes to watch company reps. I promise you that."

Tell me that when he loots your bank account, steals your identity and destroys your credit.
I make my living creating intellectual properties. People who steal them are stealing MY sweat and MY money.
They are pirates who should be hung and drawn and quartered.
Fuck Larry.
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Re: I hate Stuhrling Original

Post by LIES ALL LIES!!! » July 19th 2010, 11:28am

Here you go Don, http://www.europastar.com/magazine/highlights/1004071591-tag-heuer-addresses-the-1887.html

As for Omega, many claim the Sea Master has design cues from the Rolex sub, personally other than it's round, about 40mm wide, and it's a diver that's where the similarities stop that I see. But the Speed Master does look quite a bit like the Daytona. and I think the Rail Master has a very Ball look to it. While not "homages" per se, certainly not wholly original.

Hey I am all for Sturhling Original standing on their own work. But first they have to make a name for themselves first. I don't know if Shop NBC is that avenue to do it but they seem committed to this path of the most Skelton resistance.
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