Marc Frankel Explains Why Seikos Don't Cost Too Much

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Re: Marc Frankel Explains Why Seikos Don't Cost Too Much

Post by WISenheimer » August 5th 2024, 11:42pm

One point he could have made.

What is the benefit to the consumer of the higher prices due to being a huge company with global reach? Why not just roll with the micros?

The answer is value retention. Depreciation is likely to be less and liquidity definitely better. Always a buyer for your Seiko, etc, can be iffy for micros.
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Re: Marc Frankel Explains Why Seikos Don't Cost Too Much

Post by WISenheimer » August 6th 2024, 8:24pm

jason_recliner wrote: ↑
August 6th 2024, 5:30pm
 I reckon Seikos cost too much. Most of them, at least. There was one in a shop the other day, a nice one, but it was around AUD3,000. Fuck off.
Who buys a Seiko in a shop? Maybe Bic Camera or Yodobashi in Japan or Citiiwide in Hong Kong, joints like that, but for the most part a practice to avoid imo.
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Re: Marc Frankel Explains Why Seikos Don't Cost Too Much

Post by jason_recliner » August 7th 2024, 12:17am

WISenheimer wrote: ↑
August 6th 2024, 8:24pm
jason_recliner wrote: ↑
August 6th 2024, 5:30pm
 I reckon Seikos cost too much. Most of them, at least. There was one in a shop the other day, a nice one, but it was around AUD3,000. Fuck off.
Who buys a Seiko in a shop? Maybe Bic Camera or Yodobashi in Japan or Citiiwide in Hong Kong, joints like that, but for the most part a practice to avoid imo.
I quite like buying from shops when I can, in fact I much prefer it, I'm a bit of a sickie.
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Re: Marc Frankel Explains Why Seikos Don't Cost Too Much

Post by WISenheimer » August 7th 2024, 11:14am

jason_recliner wrote: ↑
August 7th 2024, 12:17am
WISenheimer wrote: ↑
August 6th 2024, 8:24pm
jason_recliner wrote: ↑
August 6th 2024, 5:30pm
 I reckon Seikos cost too much. Most of them, at least. There was one in a shop the other day, a nice one, but it was around AUD3,000. Fuck off.
Who buys a Seiko in a shop? Maybe Bic Camera or Yodobashi in Japan or Citiiwide in Hong Kong, joints like that, but for the most part a practice to avoid imo.
I quite like buying from shops when I can, in fact I much prefer it, I'm a bit of a sickie.
Nothing the matter with that, it is a pleasant experience. Just that with Seikos anyhow, there is often a significant premium attached to this. You get what you pay for, again, nothing wrong with that.
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Re: Marc Frankel Explains Why Seikos Don't Cost Too Much

Post by smellody » August 7th 2024, 12:41pm

conjurer wrote: ↑
August 7th 2024, 12:38pm
smellody wrote: ↑
August 7th 2024, 11:51am
 I made it to 1:27. Too many words.... he is annoying.

Also, what's a Marc Franco? Is that like a line of clothing for TJ Maxx?
He owns Long Island Watches, you goof! He also owns Islander Watches, which are said to be the tits.
He needs to get to the point. I don't have all day.
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Re: Marc Frankel Explains Why Seikos Don't Cost Too Much

Post by WISenheimer » August 8th 2024, 9:53pm

Another observation Marc “Too many notes” Frankel could have made as he yammered on.

In the USA at least, public perception of Seiko has changed a lot. 20 years ago, Seikos were universally regarded as low end mall watches. Myself, I started noticing a shift about 7-8 years ago when normies would get interested in my watch simply because it was a Seiko. This was first evident among younger people in my experience and quite surprising at first.

Now it seems common for randos to view Seikos as a well made, quality product. Not a luxury watch, but certainly not a throw away cheapo item.

And it is a rational perception and also one that allows pricing to rise to those expectations. It is largely a legacy attitude that Seikos are supposed to be cheap and should never exceed certain price points simply because it is labeled Seiko.

Basically, the market will bear higher prices than in the past for Seikos and the company would be foolish to not act on that.

Over the past several decades, a lot of Japanese products have made a transition from exceptional value for price to value and price being commensurate.

One current holdout is Citizen imo. Still lots of bang for the buck there on lots of their models.
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Re: Marc Frankel Explains Why Seikos Don't Cost Too Much

Post by jason_recliner » August 9th 2024, 12:28am

WISenheimer wrote: ↑
August 8th 2024, 9:53pm
 Another observation Marc “Too many notes” Frankel could have made as he yammered on.

In the USA at least, public perception of Seiko has changed a lot. 20 years ago, Seikos were universally regarded as low end mall watches. Myself, I started noticing a shift about 7-8 years ago when normies would get interested in my watch simply because it was a Seiko. This was first evident among younger people in my experience and quite surprising at first.

Now it seems common for randos to view Seikos as a well made, quality product. Not a luxury watch, but certainly not a throw away cheapo item.

And it is a rational perception and also one that allows pricing to rise to those expectations. It is largely a legacy attitude that Seikos are supposed to be cheap and should never exceed certain price points simply because it is labeled Seiko.

Basically, the market will bear higher prices than in the past for Seikos and the company would be foolish to not act on that.

Over the past several decades, a lot of Japanese products have made a transition from exceptional value for price to value and price being commensurate.

One current holdout is Citizen imo. Still lots of bang for the buck there on lots of their models.
Spot on. Being the broke tight-arse that I am, Seiko really appealed because they sold really good watches at really reasonable prices. Now they are really good watches at really high prices, there's not really any reason for me to buy any more, and there are plenty of other brands selling really good watches at really high prices. As you say, Citizen is maybe the last brand offering more than what you've paid for, other than the Chinese brands Ron posts sometimes.
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Re: Marc Frankel Explains Why Seikos Don't Cost Too Much

Post by WISenheimer » August 9th 2024, 10:09pm

I feel like I am over Seikos myself now. Or at least on my terminal one, my SBDC171/SPB313. Quite a fine watch that has been my daily this year. But I see nothing in their catalog that I want to acquire or think I would like as much as this one.

It was a good ride with them since my first one in 1979 but all good things come to an end. Maybe if they started making affordable spring drive models instead of keeping this as an exclusive high end thing.

In addition to their higher prices, they have quit innovating, which also makes them a less interesting company.

The Citizen NB1050 is one of the greatest values out there right now. You can pick one of these up for 350 USD and you get 28.8 BPH movement, Duratec Platinum coating, excellent case form/finishing, classic dial layout.

Really a SARB033 for 2024. Mystery why it has not become as popular.

When anti scratch treatment/coatings become popular on Chinese watches is when I will become interested. I have become a fan of antiscratch stuff, really like watch staying nice and shiny. Otherwise, some great stuff coming out of there at incredible prices
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Re: Marc Frankel Explains Why Seikos Don't Cost Too Much

Post by WISenheimer » August 15th 2024, 3:31pm

3Flushes wrote: ↑
August 14th 2024, 5:18am
 Lotta dough for those made out of country. MIJ can be worth the premium.
In addition, I like to get the JDM reference examples and from a Japanese dealer. Not sure if it makes a difference but surely can’t hurt and I have never had the minor QA issues that lots of non-Japan buyers seem to complain about - misaligned bezels/chapter rings, sketchy regulation on 6R35 movement, dial smudges/dust etc

And typically no premium for these over the export variants

Last time I set my SBDC171 was at least two months ago and just checked, it has gained 16 seconds in that time

Spring drive territory
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